It is currently: May 04, '24, 5:43 am |
Everlong wrote:"By Endorsing Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders May Have Positioned Himself to Win The Presidency"
That article has to be satire, right?
That entire Q&A just reeks of a complete disconnect with reality. It's over. It's been over for months. As much as I like Sanders, and as much as I dislike Clinton, it's over. Bernie knows it's over. Most rational people do. There is no "masterful chess move" or hidden motive of pulling out all the stops at the convention. It's done.
Everlong wrote:So I guess Bernie's "masterful chess move" didn't exactly work out?
KaiserGlider wrote:Everlong wrote:"By Endorsing Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders May Have Positioned Himself to Win The Presidency"
That article has to be satire, right?
That entire Q&A just reeks of a complete disconnect with reality. It's over. It's been over for months. As much as I like Sanders, and as much as I dislike Clinton, it's over. Bernie knows it's over. Most rational people do. There is no "masterful chess move" or hidden motive of pulling out all the stops at the convention. It's done.
The scary thing is, that article isn't satire and shows that there's plenty of hardcore Bern victims out there still clinging on and refusing to accept anything other than their god winning outright. Every time they don't get what they want, there's always an excuse. Bernie got screwed by the voting system, or Bernie got screwed by the media, or Bernie got screwed by the delegates, or "they" threatened to shut Bernie out of the convention if he didn't endorse Hillary (...what?). The guy just can't lose. Even though he held out long enough to get a lot of his progressive policies on the Democratic platform, which is a great compromise, especially when you consider what the expectations for Bernie were before he started his campaign.
I guarantee you'll see articles a year from now saying there's still hope because "they'll see the light" and automatically make Bernie president because it's obviously what everybody wants, and the FBI investigation will uncover evidence proving that Bernie lost by almost 4 million votes because Hillary flew around the country on her broomstick casting spells that fucked with the count.
Hanley! wrote:It's been clear for quite a while that Sanders wasn't going to be the Democratic candidate. But it strikes me that it's still a bad sign for Clinton's presidential campaign that so many people are still talking about Bernie. I originally thought that Trump would lose the election because those who make up the usual swing vote wouldn't be inclined to vote for a celebrity/joke over an actual politician. But it's very clear that Hilary isn't an exciting candidate and I can't see huge numbers of centrists rushing out to vote for her either, and now she doesn't have all of the Democrats on her side either. It seems like we might get unprecedented numbers of left-leaning voters either sitting at home or casting their votes for third party candidates.
It's a little sad that I'm so worried that a candidate will lose, when at the same time, I care so little about her winning.
DBSoT wrote:I still can't believe people think Trump has any chance of winning.
I have and I still don't believe Trump has any chance of winning. I also base that on Trump getting destroyed on a debate stage.Everlong wrote:DBSoT wrote:I still can't believe people think Trump has any chance of winning.
If you're paying attention to any of the major polls, it's quite close right now.
VaderBomb wrote:You have no idea what you're talking about.
VaderBomb wrote:He's the most brilliant politician in America,
Who ever said that this was the case? Maybe Bernie supporters did, but for me, I absolutely accept that my guy won't win. It is a long journey for 3rd party candidates, but getting on the debate stage and stealing 13-15% of the general election vote makes people take notice. Especially in a year where people have such a low opinion of the Dem-Rep candidates. People always go back to the wasted vote argument, but that is inaccurate. If I don't vote Johnson, than I likely wouldn't vote at all. If I don't vote at all than I am just helping the 2 party system to continue to exist. People all want to talk about progress in this country, but people are lazy. They may want progress, but they accept crap, out of convenience. "Well only Hillary and Trump can win, so I guess I have to just sit there and take it up the ass." This is the last time I am saying this, because my record has clearly been broken, but I don't care if you vote for Bernie, Jill Stein, or Gary Johnson. I just want to see record high votes for 3rd party candidates. If for no other reason than to force the country to expand their thinking. I also realize as I type this that it is futile. We live in a country of people that are willing to vote for a Trump/Pence ticket, so maybe it will just always be about the letter (R/D) next to the names.And I get it, people are sick of voting for the "lesser of two evils", but, I am sorry, a third party is NOT a viable option, it just isn't, the majority of Americans are still going to vote for either Trump or Clinton, so whichever one you want less, you have to vote for the other one to be sure, and if you want neither, TOUGH.
Ali wrote:I get it. Hillary is corrupt as all hell, she bought the election from the start, Bernie never had a chance.
I'm still not willing to NOT vote for her.
I do not want Mike Pence in charge of this country. Because Donald Trump is NOT going to do anything, he's going to have the title of President and take a four year vacation.
And I get it, people are sick of voting for the "lesser of two evils", but, I am sorry, a third party is NOT a viable option, it just isn't, the majority of Americans are still going to vote for either Trump or Clinton, so whichever one you want less, you have to vote for the other one to be sure, and if you want neither, TOUGH.
But what burns me up the most, what really pisses me off more than anything... what did we expect to happen if Bernie won? Why do we have to wait for four years at a time to make these issues such a big deal? Do people honestly think that if Sanders won, he would step into the Oval Office and find the hidden "Make Everything Better" button? No, that'd be stupid, but it feels like what people expected!
Change takes time. Progress is a process. If we want the world to change, we have to start from the bottom up. Not just every four years at the top level, its gotta be constant involvement.
But now, because Bernie didn't win, which was a very likely outcome from the beginning... we're willing to throw away all of the progress he fought for out of spite?! We're gonna put Mike Pence in the driver's seat just because--gasp!--a politician is corrupt?! Perish the thought! This is unheard of! /s
At the very least, Bernie is STILL going to hold Hillary to her promises as best he can. Probably small consolation, but hey, take what we can get.
I don't like it either, but it's just how it is.
KaiserGlider wrote:VaderBomb wrote:You have no idea what you're talking about.
Guess that makes two of us then. And calling me close-minded... coming from the guy who said anyone that is against Bernie is clearly against humanity (OH THE HUMANITY), the guy who said Kanye West would make a better candidate than almost everyone else who ran this year, the guy who promised Bernie would run as an independent because "trust me", the guy who saw some random blog on social media saying Bernie is still gonna win, believed every word of it and posted it here as if it was a legit article.
I like Bernie. I voted for Bernie in the CA primaries. You have to appreciate how far he's come and what he was able to add to the Democratic platform. I have no problem with Bernie supporters (like overlord Tim) who can acknowledge when he has no chance anymore, or Bernie supporters who can admit that Bernie did not run a perfect campaign and perhaps he may have made some mistakes that cost him votes: Like not attacking Hillary hard enough, saying he was "sick of hearing about her damn emails", not expanding his target audience far enough past college liberals, or not reaching blacks in the South where he did very poorly in votes.
I believe there's a difference between these people and Bern victims who hear what they want to hear even if it doesn't always align with reality or what Bernie is saying. If you want to interpret that as me wanting to suppress Bernie's message, then ok. Not surprising given your argument so far.
There is no concrete proof of the DNC massively rigging the primaries to specifically screw him at every single turn. That's your constant go-to excuse every time Bernie doesn't win something. The link you posted is all very speculative stuff that implies that Bernie (and of course only Bernie), was hurt by possible instances of fraud, and that of course he would be winning, in a landslide to boot, if it weren't for suppression. And they cite unreliable exit polls. Perhaps the gap between Bernie and Hillary would have been closer, but that's as much as I'm willing to believe. Since you believe everything you read, here's some articles to at least consider:
Exit Polls and No Stolen Primary From Sanders - NY Times
On Voter Fraud in New York
On Voter Fraud in Arizona
Debunking Election Fraud Allegations
Democratic Primary Wasn't Rigged
For the Last Time
There IS concrete proof that the DNC privately favored Clinton over Sanders, but is that really so shocking when you take into account the fact that 1) Bernie has been an outsider for his entire political career and has never been a Democratic party member at heart, 2) he criticized the DNC's voting system throughout his entire campaign, and 3) he actually sued the DNC while 4) Hillary spent decades building relationships with the DNC. Why would the DNC favor him over Hillary? Why would the superdelegates - who Sanders has called "undemocratic" - suddenly change their minds and vote for him even though he lost by 4 million votes?VaderBomb wrote:He's the most brilliant politician in America,
This I can agree with. He took your money and he ain't giving it back.
DBSoT wrote:Fox News Poll has Hillary Clinton leading Donald Trump by 10%. Take that for what it's worth.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/08 ... lawed.html
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